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Crap, this is so tempting.I'm a UK8F, I'm x sure if this would be too big for me...

 

Owh man, there's a pair of double monks in my size...hmmm..x sure I'm willing to pay RM1200 for a pair of used shoes even if it's Vass...would rather but Carmina's by adding another RM300...

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What are you gents aiming for? I am half-heartedly aiming for an Edward Green 'Dover' but I really must try on the various lasts before I drop that kind of money on a pair of shoes!

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I think it's okay to buy online if you have something to compare to. Lots of guys on SF are comparing the size differences between the makers. So if you have a common pair of shoes you can decipher the codes and get a pretty good fit. But personally I'd much prefer to try them on before I drop a limb for it. Every shoe fits differently on another dude's feet, feels different, looks different, and all that. Vass is cheaper sex than EG but just as good (depending on who you ask). I think with the exception of me, a small timer. Everyone here is medium timer upwards.

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Did anyone read Manton's account of his visit to Edward Green in Northampton?

 

One of the most interesting things I learned from that was that Green shoes today are far better than anything else they've put out in the last 20 years. Manton describes how Green's lasts, uppers and general styling and workmanship have improved and attained a level of quality in the last few years than at any time in its recent history. I guess it's an inversion of the 'things get better with age' maxim that many style geeks may subscribe to. Great brands generally decline over time, after all. See Florsheim or any of the American makers, and recently, some of the English ones too.

 

That's not to say the same necessarily applies to C&J, of course, but that thread did get me thinking about the quality of a vintage offering compared to a contemporary one.

 

Here's the thread: http://www.styleforum.net/showthread.php?t=59653

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It is likely that Green makes better shoes than before. Even A&S makes better suits today than before.

 

However, it is interesting to see that they, too, use fabric tape in the sole like everyone else nowadays. I used to be on a shoe forum and the shoemakers there said this is a bad cost-cutting developement that makes the shoe structurally weaker. The Goodyear welt as originally done requires stitching the insole to the welt. Now, it is glued on via the fabric tape. The adoption of the fabric tape seems to have come about in the 90s.

 

I don't think its a big deal but thought I'd mention this since I found such a nice pic of the fabric tape in Manton's post.

p1020449sb3.jpg

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I found some illustrations of the different variations of make in shoes. This is the hand-sewn make. Notice that the welt is secured to the insole via stitches.

800px-Handeingestochene_Machart.jpg

 

This is the original Goodyear make. It is a variation of the hand-sewn version. The welt is still secured to the insole by means of machine-stitches.

Rahmengenähte-Risslippen-Machart.jpg

 

And this is the current make of almost all English shoemakers. The welt is sewn to a tape, and the tape is in turn secured to the insole via glue. The insole is not sewn.

800px-Gemb.jpg

 

Apart from the simplicity of gluing instead of sewing, the last method of make allows the use of thinner insoles, because the insole no longer needs to be cut and shaped to allow the sewing.

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Modern shoemakers also save costs by using a leather fiberboard for the insole instead of a piece of real leather. This is a picture from "Posh", an independent German shoemaker comparing the leather composite insole of a C&J Handgrade to a piece of Rendenbach leather (the real thing originally used). You can see a bit of the fabric tape at the bottom of the insole.

 

cimg3129h.jpg

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So English 'Goodyear welted' shoes today are not actually Goodyear welted, then? The term surely means that the insole and welt are stitched together? But now if the insole isn't stitched at all, then is it still Goodyear welted?

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PSA on Crockett and Jones loafers and monkstrap, starting at USD220. I'm not sure if they are firsts or seconds.

 

Not much of a PSA for us in Malaysia actually, since it will be only slightly cheaper than P Lal after shipping. But Threedifferent regularly has great prices on a variety of stuff, so it's worth checking back.

 

BTW, does anyone know if P Lal is able to give good fitting advice for the various C&J lasts?

 

http://www.styleforum.net/t/146312/official-events-and-psa-thread/2970#post_4982200

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I've seen the shoes at the launch and I like the penny loafers best. I feel like Ed's new lasts will bring out the elegance in more formal styles like an oxford. I'm sure we will see more and better designs from Ed Et Al in the near future.

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Joonian, what's your opinion on the quality since you've seen the shoes up close?do you spending SGD250 on it is better the spending RM699 on a pair of cheaney's at PLAL?

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