Posted 25 November 2011 - 03:44 PM
One of the most interesting things I learned from that was that Green shoes today are far better than anything else they've put out in the last 20 years. Manton describes how Green's lasts, uppers and general styling and workmanship have improved and attained a level of quality in the last few years than at any time in its recent history. I guess it's an inversion of the 'things get better with age' maxim that many style geeks may subscribe to. Great brands generally decline over time, after all. See Florsheim or any of the American makers, and recently, some of the English ones too.
That's not to say the same necessarily applies to C&J, of course, but that thread did get me thinking about the quality of a vintage offering compared to a contemporary one.
Here's the thread: http://www.styleforu...ead.php?t=59653
Posted 25 November 2011 - 05:38 PM
However, it is interesting to see that they, too, use fabric tape in the sole like everyone else nowadays. I used to be on a shoe forum and the shoemakers there said this is a bad cost-cutting developement that makes the shoe structurally weaker. The Goodyear welt as originally done requires stitching the insole to the welt. Now, it is glued on via the fabric tape. The adoption of the fabric tape seems to have come about in the 90s.
I don't think its a big deal but thought I'd mention this since I found such a nice pic of the fabric tape in Manton's post.
Posted 25 November 2011 - 06:48 PM
This is the original Goodyear make. It is a variation of the hand-sewn version. The welt is still secured to the insole by means of machine-stitches.
And this is the current make of almost all English shoemakers. The welt is sewn to a tape, and the tape is in turn secured to the insole via glue. The insole is not sewn.
Apart from the simplicity of gluing instead of sewing, the last method of make allows the use of thinner insoles, because the insole no longer needs to be cut and shaped to allow the sewing.
Posted 25 November 2011 - 07:15 PM
Posted 26 November 2011 - 03:48 PM
Not much of a PSA for us in Malaysia actually, since it will be only slightly cheaper than P Lal after shipping. But Threedifferent regularly has great prices on a variety of stuff, so it's worth checking back.
BTW, does anyone know if P Lal is able to give good fitting advice for the various C&J lasts?
Posted 28 November 2011 - 01:00 AM
@Andrew very nice! Almost copped a pair myself
Posted 30 November 2011 - 04:21 PM
Fitwise: they sides were pretty narrow, I had to go to my cobbler to stretch it out for me, was much comfortable after stretching.
The shoes are actually made in Vietnam, and the soles could do with a better finishing, some of the edges are still rough. Overall great value for money
Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:49 PM
I'm not an authority on shoes at all, so I'll just tell you how I see this.
So English 'Goodyear welted' shoes today are not actually Goodyear welted, then? The term surely means that the insole and welt are stitched together? But now if the insole isn't stitched at all, then is it still Goodyear welted?
It's a modified Goodyear welted process. The GY process itself is a cost-saving process that mechanized the handsewing, significantly increasing the output of the shoe producer. The latest iteration with the fabric tape and glue is just a continuation of the process of making shoes more cheaply.
The problem with "heritage" products like shoes and suits is that they have all been superseeded by genuinely modern products so there is not much room for innovation that increases the functionality while reducing costs. All that is left is to reduce costs.
Some unit cost improvements are found in using faster machines, machines that produce less scrap, and in improvents in the supply chain. Some cost improvements are achived through design changes to the shoe itself, even if accompanied by reduced functionality, so long as they are relatively imperceptible to the typical customer.
That's how I see this development.
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