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The suiting thread


kotmj
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Oh no, I don't like hacking pockets. I cannot explain why, I just don't like them. Yes to all the rest. But they're all not specific measurements (like lapel width), and everything has to look proportionate and harmonious. Gestalt. I'm not so sure what your definition of stylish means, but yes, I also don't fancy low "droopy" gorges. The other end of the spectrum is too high a gorge (or is it determined by something else? I forgot the French guide thing you posted somewhere) - a good example would be one of those ubiquitous Neapolitan jackets with the tip of the peak lapels way above the shoulder that you can see it sticking out from behind.

 

Moderation, is key.

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Makes sense. Anything to do with value for $ too? Or would you say it's in large part due to the types of material/pictures you view that in turn influence your taste? (this reminds me why one always has to target a specific audience when pitching a product).

 

Do you have a picture which you think depicts a guy in a good suit?

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Value for money is a bit tough, since it hasn't really been a variable over here. Materials/pictures play a role, yes, but there isn't any one specific photo that has made me a convert to a certain something. It's through many pictures I've seen on the Internet and some suits (admittedly quite limited) in the flesh, I learned what I like.

 

One picture would be the below, but I wouldn't have a suit made exactly in such configurations, rather taking cues here and there. But it has what I like in a suit. Some others include Vox's photos I've seen around.

 

guq0xYA.jpg

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That IS nice, and it does have the wide lapels, though not so high gorge (that is, higher than mine) you said you like. Heavy fabric too, no doubt.

 

Maybe you're looking for smth to anchor your interest, and the dramatic lapels with the sharp peaks, do indeed holds one's gaze (plus of course, the good fit). In contrast, I'd THINK that mine isn't visually interesting because it blends everything together, and there's nothing dramatic that would in turn be more visually arresting. Yes?

 

You did say that you like peak lapels, yes? So possibly that would be visually arresting, and thus, sweet peak lapels are the game changer.

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That IS nice, and it does have the wide lapels, though not so high gorge (that is, higher than mine) you said you like. Heavy fabric too, no doubt.

 

Maybe you're looking for smth to anchor your interest, and the dramatic lapels with the sharp peaks, do indeed holds one's gaze (plus of course, the good fit). In contrast, I'd THINK that mine isn't visually interesting because it blends everything together, and there's nothing dramatic that would in turn be more visually arresting. Yes?

 

You did say that you like peak lapels, yes? So possibly that would be visually arresting, and thus, sweet peak lapels are the game changer.

 

Maybe. I cannot really say whether that's the reason why I like the suit in the above picture. But it's not just visual interest. Vox's suits are well balanced, just like yours. Nothing in particular sticks out like the peak lapels in Cooper's suit above for example, except perhaps the immaculate fit (in the sea of today's ill-fitting suits). And I like them too, so it's not just merely visual interest. Sure, visual interest counts for something, but it doesn't play a big part.

 

Yes, peak lapels are a personal preference. But I'm only partial to those that are angled in a specific way. I see a lot of jackets with peak lapels that I don't like, so it's not peak lapels in general, but a certain "kind" of peak lapel that I fancy.

 

I also see many notch lapels that I really, really like. Some include the suits owned by the men from Armoury (strictly lapel-wise).

 

Peak lapels are just nothing but a personal preference. They're not something I must have on a jacket. I'd wear a suit with notch lapels without a second thought. It's only if you were to ask me which I preferred that I'd pick the peak.

 

Maybe it's the relative uncommonness of peak lapels around. Maybe it's because there are so many more variables to peak lapels.

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^ For the record I will state that I find boys' jacket to be very well cut and looks great.

 

I would say the type of aesthetic one chooses will attract different kinds of woman. This is akin to using different bait to catch different fish. As not all women are the same after all and one cannot simply go....what type of jacket would be more appealing to all females?

 

The free spirited hippie? In that case, no amount of suiting would impress. Get a beard going and tell her about the time you were in Sumatra saving the 3 legged red spotted woodpecker.

 

The ambitious exec? Yes maybe a Tom Ford power suit or something which conveys success, standing and power would do the trick.

 

15 year old girl? - refer to the suits donned by One Direction.

 

To answer your question, personally, I love soft natural shoulders cut slightly narrower, only very slight waist suppression, shorter jacket (but still covering the goods), mid-width lapels, and soft chest construction.

 

On my theory of what makes a suit jump out at me - it's alot about how the person carries himself in the suit he is wearing. When it is a congruent package, the effect is quite impressive. E.g. I have a trim and fit 35 year old partner of greek heritage, known for his aggressive and flamboyant style - he wears slimmer cut suits, with aggressive waist suppression and natural shoulders to accentuate his strong shoulders. He also favours rich bright fabrics - like a bright AF blue number he has with some sheen to it. I look at him and go wow!

 

Put the same suit on the 50 year old partner, with a stockier build and balding, who is known to be very conservative and quietly dominant, and it would look wrong. The cut wouldn't work for him. He'd look like he borrowed his nephew's suit.

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But it's not just visual interest. Vox's suits are well balanced, just like yours.

 

Which of Vox suits do you like? His NSM ones or Steed ones? I think you might have subconsciously gauged the suit based on my assemble of the day with that green tie (and white looking shirt, though it's blue and white stripes).

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^ For the record I will state that I find boys' jacket to be very well cut and looks great.

 

I would say the type of aesthetic one chooses will attract different kinds of woman. This is akin to using different bait to catch different fish. As not all women are the same after all and one cannot simply go....what type of jacket would be more appealing to all females?

 

The free spirited hippie? In that case, no amount of suiting would impress. Get a beard going and tell her about the time you were in Sumatra saving the 3 legged red spotted woodpecker.

 

The ambitious exec? Yes maybe a Tom Ford power suit or something which conveys success, standing and power would do the trick.

 

15 year old girl? - refer to the suits donned by One Direction.

 

To answer your question, personally, I love soft natural shoulders cut slightly narrower, only very slight waist suppression, shorter jacket (but still covering the goods), mid-width lapels, and soft chest construction.

 

On my theory of what makes a suit jump out at me - it's alot about how the person carries himself in the suit he is wearing. When it is a congruent package, the effect is quite impressive. E.g. I have a trim and fit 35 year old partner of greek heritage, known for his aggressive and flamboyant style - he wears slimmer cut suits, with aggressive waist suppression and natural shoulders to accentuate his strong shoulders. He also favours rich bright fabrics - like a bright AF blue number he has with some sheen to it. I look at him and go wow!

 

Put the same suit on the 50 year old partner, with a stockier build and balding, who is known to be very conservative and quietly dominant, and it would look wrong. The cut wouldn't work for him. He'd look like he borrowed his nephew's suit.

 

Good point, and you're right that different women would be interested in different looks. And I was thinking about it, and people do tend to think Bond as played by Craig wore his suit well. They think it made him look masculine and dashing (plus with all that sex and violence, it's easy to conflate everything together).

 

You seem to like the Italian silhouette (generalization). I've been lking through the Italian stuff and there are two 'styles ' that I quite fancy. Somehow, I'm not sure I like the Neapolitan as much the Florence style (Liverano) and the Rome silhouette (Caraceni). I was speaking to a friend who used Caraceni in Rome and he was very pleased with the outcome given that he had minimal fittings.

 

I think the challenge is extrapolating details on suits I think look nice on others and thinking about how they would look on me, given my physique, if included. I know chunkier friends who look at suits on slim guys and say 'wow, that's cool! etc'. I might be willing to post a picture sometime -- I do like the three button suits I've seen about and decided to have a go at it despite adamant insistence by my tailor I shouldn't. The coat came out well, but somehow, it doesn't look nice/flattering on me.

 

Also, how many partners do you have? One 50 and one 35? Do they know about each other? How do you manage your time accordingly? I have one GF and I find it hard to allocate time already. :D

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One doesn't book a flight with airasia. One attempts to book 5 flights over and over until it finally works. There is no more shittier user experience than the airsia website.

 

Just MAS it up.

 

 

Which of Vox suits do you like? His NSM ones or Steed ones? I think you might have subconsciously gauged the suit based on my assemble of the day with that green tie (and white looking shirt, though it's blue and white stripes).

 

His Steed ones. I think trousers like his wouldn't look flattering on me (cut-wise, not measurement-for-measurement), but they're quite beautiful. Though Vox isn't exactly applicable, I now realise, since his few Steed suits I remember have notch lapels and not-so-open quarters. To be honest, I haven't exactly seen very many of Vox's photos, so I cannot really substantiate. I apologise, maybe Vox isn't such a good example.

 

There are many suits I see that I like because of specific elements that appeal to me. An example would be one of Ethan (Armoury)'s suits by WW Chan; a one-button peak lapel pinstripe. I really like the colour and the lapels (angle of peak, size, etc.). But I'd prefer a roomier fit and a two-button configuration. I rarely see suits that I wholly like, rather suits that possess specific constituents I like. So I'd take bits and pieces and put them together. A little bit of an indelicate explanation, I admit. Of course, it doesn't always work, everything has to fall together in a harmonious union.

 

You may be right about me subconsciously gauging the entire ensemble, taking into account your shirt, tie and trousers. Never mind it! I think we've managed to have quite a good discussion hitherto. Your jacket is nice (seriously). I can understand why it's nice too. It's just not to my taste, that's all. Maybe nice is an understatement, but I don't want to use a thesaurus, k? :lol:

 

 

N, you're right about different women possessing different preferences in what they'd like to see a man wear. The same would go for us them, so it's only natural. But I was writing in response to the statement that women generally fawn over an acquaintance in a suit. It's not specific enough, I admit, so it doesn't make for too much of an argument with gravitas.

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N, you're right about different women possessing different preferences in what they'd like to see a man wear. The same would go for us them, so it's only natural. But I was writing in response to the statement that women generally fawn over an acquaintance in a suit. It's not specific enough, I admit, so it doesn't make for too much of an argument with gravitas.

 

Yes, I agree generally the women I find attractive to prefer guys in suits/ tailored clothing. I.e. not miss hippie.

 

 

 

You seem to like the Italian silhouette (generalization). I've been lking through the Italian stuff and there are two 'styles ' that I quite fancy. Somehow, I'm not sure I like the Neapolitan as much the Florence style (Liverano) and the Rome silhouette (Caraceni). I was speaking to a friend who used Caraceni in Rome and he was very pleased with the outcome given that he had minimal fittings.

 

Also, how many partners do you have? One 50 and one 35? Do they know about each other? How do you manage your time accordingly? I have one GF and I find it hard to allocate time already. :D

 

Yes, that's right, I gravitate toward more Italian style, but not the super aggressive stuff you see in Pitti. That stuff is not for the faint hearted. I had the chance to try on the Liverano jackets whilst I was visiting the Armoury. If I could afford it, I would get a wardrobe full of them - maybe to pair with my JT trousers..

 

Re: My 'partners' - they both know each other and are happy to take turns. Each division in my firm has about 4-5 who happily fuck you :)

 

Please pardon my french.

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Ok, now its my turn. This is purely my own opinion that is based on my observation, experience dealing with clients and their own feedback and also going to approximately 150 fitting sessions in the past year (which is a story on itself).

 

This post will be my opinion on your recent sports jacket, a picture of that I will reproduce again (sorry guys). I will provide my honest opinion, be blunt and hope you wont take my comments to heart.

 

IMG_3289_zps19993dd9.jpg

 

Others have commented how well made your jacket is. I agree with this.

 

Some have commented that it looks great. I personally disagree with this. To me, it looks just ok, not great.

 

My first impression is that you look like a robot in the jacket (attributed to the camera angle/your pose/both/any other factors); you seem tense and it seems that the jacket is wearing you rather then the other way around. The cut is classic but for a person of your build and age, it just swallows you up.

 

Visually, you look like a young guy wearing his dad's suit that happens to fit him well. People will look but they wont look twice. People will see you but the wont remember you. Maybe this is a good thing; maybe its a bad thing. I don't know, it depends on what is the purpose you dress up for. I'll let you know my purpose in my second post.

 

Lets have a look at Foo's jacket (I assume its a Rubinacci).

 

102108_zps66d00410.jpg

 

It is similar in certain aspects to your jacket; notch lapel, 1 button, sports jacket in a casual, patterned cloth.

 

However, if you guys walk side by side (notwithstanding the fact that you may be possibly more good looking then Foo), Foo's jacket has more of a visual impact on me compared to yours. Maybe its the open quarters; maybe its the soft shoulders, maybe its the patch pockets, maybe its the proportion of the lapels to Foo's body, maybe its the placement of the gorge. But Foo's jacket has a more 'natural' look to it. Yours looks a bit too 'uniform-ish', not something you will associate with a casual jacket.

 

Someone suggested that a structured look suits you; I personally disagree. Your body shape, your shoulders and your stance to me would be the worst candidate for a structured look. it will make you look even more uptight and boxy.

 

I personally think that a Liverano styled suit/jacket is best suited for you. The graceful lines of the suit and sweep from the lapel to the open quarters (a Liverano characteristic) will flatter your body and make it look more relax and graceful.It will still be comfortable, you can still retain your preference for high waisted pants but you'll look so so so much better.

 

Again, apologies if I have offended you with my comments above. I am just calling it as how I see it. No sugar coating, no BS; just plain old honesty.

 

*Crap, I forgot to sign in when I typed this post.

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Pal, I can handle criticism and always appreciate objective criticism if it's conducted gentlemanly and 'in good faith'.

 

I'll leave others (who are not vested in this) to agree/disagree/comment on it.

 

Talk to me about the lapel width -- do the wide lapel width complement Foo or dominate him?

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Not gentlemanly?

 

*Out of curiosity, can you see the 'technical imperfection' (that might give the coat more 'soul') in Foo's coat?

 

Talk to me about Foo's lapel width. Do they suit his frame, or dominate him?

 

Kotmj might be able to talk about balance of the lapels on mine and Foo's coat -- Are the width of lapels calibrated according to careful visual measurements?

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Not gentlemanly?

 

My comments are not gentlemanly?I do apologize if they come across that way.

 

 

 

Talk to me about Foo's lapel width. Do they suit his frame, or dominate him?

 

 

Foo's lapels for this jacket to me suit him. I have seen his other Rubinacci suits and jackets; some of the lapels are a bit too big making him look comical.

 

But since this a casual jacket and with the way it is cut, the lapels complement him. Maybe it has to do with the open quarters and it being a 1 button jacket.I'm not sure; but to me visually it suits him.

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My comments are not gentlemanly?I do apologize if they come across that way.

 

 

I was kidding. You quoted me and said that your comments 'are in good faith', and omitted mention of 'gentlemanly' so I was pulling you leg.

 

Zarium (and others), what do you guys think about Foo's outfit?

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I was kidding. You quoted me and said that your comments 'are in good faith', and omitted mention of 'gentlemanly' so I was pulling you leg.

 

You had me there man :D

 

With regards to your earlier questions, I believe Zarium and '6' has given some excellent points and I really dont have much to add. I'll try though but it will be staggered across several posts.

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Boom! The baron has spoken.

 

BTW is Liverano representative of the Florentine style? Are there other examples of Florentine tailors that are more affordable?

 

A lot of people seem to say they are; but just because people say it is doesn't make it true. Though this hasnt stopped me from admiring their work which is gorgeous.

 

Some examples:

 

tumblr_lygrmm8Dje1qad1efo1_1280_zps2896937b.jpg

 

tumblr_lv1jxxsdyt1qad1efo1_1280_zpsb69d6d82.jpg

 

 

Notice the sweep from the lapel to the open quarters? Beautiful and to me, a work of art.

 

With regards to other affordable Florentine tailors, I remember reading it somewhere. I cant remember it may be in the Journal of Style or some random blog.

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Lapels are nice. Maybe a very, very slight touch too wide for me (think 0.15"), so it's negligible.

 

His jacket has a higher buttoning point too. Either that or it's longer. The button is more towards the middle, so it creates a nice symmetry. Yours seems to have a lower buttoning point which doesn't quite visually bisect the jacket in half like Foo's. Not necessarily a bad thing. Maybe it's even due to the angle of your photo, so I cannot really tell for sure.

 

It has what I like - open quarters, high gorge, wide lapels. Soft shoulders too (I forgot to make any mention of this in my previous posts). And of course, patch pockets over hacking pockets...

 

But I don't like the fabric. I'm not next level enough like you gentlemen yet, so I cannot pull such a pattern off.

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